Subject: Re: Pacesetter Headers Date: 1999/06/30 Author: art clemensPosting History I had one years ago. They are poorly designed. The flange is restrictive and they tend to crack. I wouldn't recommend them at all. Spydaman wrote: > > J.C. Whitney sells Pacesetter headers for $96.00 to fit 1.6 through 1.8 > 8v motors. Anyone here have experiance with these headers? Also, will > I need to remove the intake manifold to install these? Thanks. > > Spy Subject: Re: Pacesetter Headers Date: 1999/06/30 Author: Patrick Schmidt Posting History I had a pace setter header for about two days, but sent it back. The finish of the piece was substandard. And yes, you'll probably end up removing your intake manifold to ease installation. Subject: Re: monza exaust Date: 1999/06/07 Author: greg szekeres Posting History In article <375986C6.6097441C@gate.net>, Whitney Turner wrote: >Try looking for "Pacesetter", IIRC. > >greg szekeres wrote: >> >> Anyone know if there is a contact number for this company. Monza. >> It appears to be owned by a bigger company as usual. My pipes don't fit!! >> >> greg Got it! My Monza exaust is too short or the pipe is bent too far, and their two piece Monza exaust doesn't fit together. Nothing like a do-it-yourself system that you need special tooling to get it right! I'll see what they say. My 77, 280Z will appreciate it! greg Subject: Re: T1 dream exhaust? Date: 1999/06/10 Author: Jan Andersson Posting History Gadget wrote: > > Howdy yall once again > > I'm looking for my dream exhaust for my SB. One that sounds good, > looks good, doesn't bottom out on everything, and most important DOES > NOT LEAK!. I was thinking of one of those Monza exhausts that have the > two large tips that exit through the factory cutouts in the rear > apron. Has anyone used one of these, Monza is CRAP. It is one of the worst choices for a street engine. A stock engine might work somehow with these. The flow is all wrong. > or maybe another type that won't hit things? Hide out. Jan Subject: Re: T1 dream exhaust? Date: 1999/06/10 Author: PEPPE Posting History Monza do not increase performance. You will feel the same performance of stock muffler with large tailpipes. It is good looking only. One good muffler is the hide away (those I have on my car) that is really quieter than stock. Another that is good is the tuck away, that with lateral slashed tailpipes. PEPPE Gadget wrote: > Howdy yall once again > > I'm looking for my dream exhaust for my SB. One that sounds good, > looks good, doesn't bottom out on everything, and most important DOES > NOT LEAK!. I was thinking of one of those Monza exhausts that have the > two large tips that exit through the factory cutouts in the rear > apron. Has anyone used one of these, or maybe another type that won't > hit things? I'm thinking about getting it painted this year, and the 4 > tip Monza style I have now bottoms out when I leave my school parking > lot. The bottom of the pipes are very scraped up, and from the > tailpipes getting pushed against the rear apron, there are wrinkles in > that now. I'd like to get rid of this problem so my new paint (when I > can afford it) won't get beat up. When I replace the muffler, I also > want to replace the heater boxes. Who makes a good quality one that I > won't have to pay through the nose for? I've seen prices about $100, > but in a few places, I've seen them for about $60. I don't want these > to go bad any time real soon. I don't feel like replacing then every 2 > or 3 years. Any help is very welcome, and I really appreciate all the > help yall have given me so far in my endeavors to keep my rust bucket > alive :) > Thain S. > > gadget@nospam.jnlk.com Re: Pacesetter Monza Exhaust System and Header ?'s Posted by Jason Scheer on July 03, 1999 at 22:08:19: mailto:Thndrsof7@aol.com In Reply to: Pacesetter Monza Exhaust System and Header ?'s posted by Greg Miner on July 03, 1999 at 19:03:59: Well, my Pacesetter Headers have cracked quite a few times and they arent old at all, maybe year, year and half? I would save up for Bill's if you want something decent and long lasting. Jason : I would like to know if anyone here own's either the Pacesetter Monza Exhaust System or Pacesetter Header. I have a 93 Storm SOHC and am considering purchasing both of these products. I would like to know if the exhaust kit provides a nice throaty sound and a descent power increase? Do the headers provide any power or performance increase? How is the fit of both of these items? I have heard the headers do not fit well. Would it be worth saving the extra money and buying the exhaust system that Bill's sells? : THANK YOU Re: Pacesetter Monza Exhaust System and Header ?'s Posted by Rich Mazzeo on July 04, 1999 at 01:36:18: mailto:N3XKU@erols.com In Reply to: Pacesetter Monza Exhaust System and Header ?'s posted by Greg Miner on July 03, 1999 at 19:03:59: : I would like to know if anyone here own's either the Pacesetter Monza Exhaust System or Pacesetter Header. I have a 93 Storm SOHC and am considering purchasing both of these products. I would like to know if the exhaust kit provides a nice throaty sound and a descent power increase? Do the headers provide any power or performance increase? How is the fit of both of these items? I have heard the headers do not fit well. Would it be worth saving the extra money and buying the exhaust system that Bill's sells? : THANK YOU I've got the cat-back exhaust (monza). I have noticed a slight performance increase, however it rattles terribly (the heat shield), has almost no sound (I've heard stock exhausts sound louder!) and since Feb. all the paint has smoked off the pipe and muffler and it is starting to rust. including inside the tip. My exhaust shop finally corrected the rattling by cutting it completely in half by the heatshield and welding it back together... In my opinion save up and get Stan's Header's brand (Bill's) or get it custom made. As far as headers I've heard bad things about all the national brands. But whatever you end up getting make sure you pay a little more and have it ceramic-coated. funny.. go ahead... Start picking on me? :) Posted by Dean on June 16, 1999 at 16:42:14: mailto:cdsweet@earthlink.net Got my header for the SOHC Storm last night. Guess what they forgot? The O2 sensor mount. Steve's MSDS Pacesetter Header Review I have an MSDS header on my 96 dohc, in a 89 s13 body. The paint boiled off the first time I started the car, and it hits the trany(5-speed). All the experience I've had with pacesetter is negative. ddrew@caverns.com Re: Pacesetter Monza Exhaust System and Header ?'s Posted by Mike Monica on July 05, 1999 at 07:59:11: In Reply to: Re: Pacesetter Monza Exhaust System and Header ?'s posted by Rich Mazzeo on July 04, 1999 at 01:36:18: Let's see, I'll go through this again... Bought the Pacesetter exhaust system, had it put on, sounded pretty good - except for the embarrasing rattles and vibrations. I had to stick little rubber washers between it and the rear crossmember so it wouldn't hit that. I spent countless hours at the exhaust shop and spent approximately the equivalent to the price of the unit having the stupid thing fine-tuned. I ended up yanking the PaceSetter off. > Subject: Re: {IM} Pacesetter header peel > Date: Tue, 20 Jul 1999 09:53:33 -0400 > From: "Chris Rhoades" > > I dealt directly with JR (who is no longer there) and voiced my > dissatisfaction. They (PaceSetter) made great plans to ship me a new header, > pre-coated in the 2000 degree stuff. But then that fell through. > > The reason PaceSetter claims to have had no complaints is that they refer > you to JetHot for assistance. JetHot wants you to run a pyrometer test to > see how hot it gets. Then they claim that they'll upgrade you to the 2000 > degree coating. But that's _if_ you pull your header and ship it to them. > > BTW, that warranty only applies if you had the piece coated inside and out. > As I recall, that was the _first_ question JetHot asked me. They seemed a > little dejected when I told them that it was, in fact, coated inside and > out. > > I > worry about internal chipping though. I can imagine my cat half clogged with > ceramic chips. > > As a side note, you might also mention to Fred that they shipped the last > batch of SOHC headers without the O2 bungs installed. I'm sure he's > painfully aware of it already though. :o) > > -Chris Subject: Re: Pacesetter Headers Date: 1999/06/30 Author: art clemens I had one years ago. They are poorly designed. The flange is restrictive and they tend to crack. I wouldn't recommend them at all. Spydaman wrote: > > J.C. Whitney sells Pacesetter headers for $96.00 to fit 1.6 through 1.8 > 8v motors. Anyone here have experiance with these headers? Also, will > I need to remove the intake manifold to install these? Thanks. > > Spy Subject: Re: Pacesetter Headers Date: 1999/06/30 Author: Patrick Schmidt I had a pace setter header for about two days, but sent it back. The finish of the piece was substandard. Subject: Re: Exhaust for 98 SC2, any ideas? Date: 1999/07/16 Author: Harry King However, I put a Pacesetter Header on Wednesday. For $142 from Summit, it isn't bad. However, it required some modification. Fortunately, I have a friend who owns a shop and I was able to take it up there this morning, put it on the rack, pull out the blow torch, and fix it. Basically, the header rests against the sway bar, and you have to dent it (you heat it with the acetylene torch). The bad things are that it didn't quite fit onto the cat converter very well. It shifted a couple of inches (to the left?). It also is vibrating a little bit. I think that I'll loosen up the bolts in the elbow (it doesn't have that flexible part like the factory header) to see if that helps. It is kind of buzzing a tad under acceleration. Also, it took me 4.5 hours to do it, plus about an hour this morning. However, I hooked it all up, did some measurements, then took it apart before I cut my old exhaust pipe. If you cut about 1" back of the last bend (before the cat), you are okay. That will save you a couple of hours of time (if you do this yourself). Harry Subject: Re: DC Sports Header Date: 1999/07/08 Author: Alberto I Correa Stay away from Pacesetter. Just my 2¢ worth. Subject: Re: DC Sports Header Date: 1999/07/09 Author:Cybernetic Samurai The latest Sport Compact Car showed a Pacesetter Install resulted in lower HP gain than stock on their dyno. What you pay for is what you get. Subject: Re: PACESETTER H-PIPES? Date: 1999/07/27 Author: Woody93LX On 27 Jul 1999 11:18:12 GMT, coolprep@aol.com (COOLPREP) wrote: >I have a mac hpipe now..and am not happy with it...my local shop sells >pacesetter's has anyone heard anything about these? if they're made with the same quality as their muffler kits, etc...expect rust w/i 1 month. Subject: Re: PACESETTER H-PIPES? Date: 1999/07/27 Author: Admin yeah they are shit, don't buy them........... Subject: Re: 22R Header / Emissions Crap Date: 1999/07/30 Author: Oldmage My experience with PaceSetter was not good, and it hasn't been for many other Celica owners. PaceSetter is generally to be avoided. Subject: hey Date: Mon, 23 Aug 1999 14:36:08 EDT From: KAC301@aol.com hey....i just got a 91" storm just under a month now...i put a K&N filter,fog lights,and a pacesetter exhaust so far...but that exhaust is making so much noice....its rattling and hitting like everything under my car...do you know how to get this to stop if there is a way? Subject: Re: After-market header for '91 Probe GL? Date: 1999/08/30 Author: bbb Steve, If you are thinking about Pacesetter headers, the installation is nowhere near as easy as it looks. The set I got had holes that did not match-up with the studs on the engine block. Installation was a long painful trial-and-error process of drilling-out the holes, trial-fitting, drilling-out the holes again, etc. Not to be attempted by any but the most patient mechanic. The EGR pipe had to be heated with a torch (until it was glowing) and bent to match-up with the new manifold. The supplied gaskets were made out of kraft paper by a kindergarten class. In the end, when everything was finally assembled and the car was started, the black paint on the new manifold all smoked off in a blaze of glory. It seems that Pacesetter is using low-temperature paint and doesn't think this is worth mentioning on the one-page badly xeroxed instructions (which are really only two drawings made by the same kindergarten class). Subject: Re: pacesetter headers for 85 gti??? Date: 1999/09/04 Author: Recker Pacesetter sux dont get it my friend has pacesetter "dual" exhaust on his neon it is horrible, sounds like ass... Subject: Re: Celica question Date: 1999/09/06 Author: AJR I would stay away from Pacesetter. They are known to rust bad. Subject: Re: pacesetter headers for 85 gti??? Date: 1999/09/04 Author: Randy Walters "Johann Tran" wrote: >i have an 85 gti and was wondering if anyone out there has any experiences >with pacesetter header for this car. Please help!!! experiences with other >brands of headers are welcome Pacesetter has poor quality stuff and it's low price is the big clue. Subject: Re: Pacesetter Cat-Back Exhaust system, opinions? Date: 1999/10/07 Author: Steven Dudkiewicz i was told the pacesetter is ok for california, cuz the weather is constant but it would fall apart in 2 years in montreal due to the temp dif and the salt and shit Steve wrote in message news:7tibkg$ol7$1@nnrp1.deja.com... > I'm considering buying the Pacesetter Cat-Back Exhaust system to install > on my '94 SC2. Has anyone installed it on their car? I want to know > how easy it is to install and the quality of the material. I read the > info on the SPS website already. Where is a good place to buy it, > Summit? > > Is there any other good exhaust systems available for saturn that are > inexpensive? What can I expect to pay for a new exhaust (not including > the c. converter or header) if I take it in to have it done? > > Thanks for your suggestions, > Jim Posted by Brian Gunther on October 23, 1999 at 22:20:24: Just installed header and exhaust from pacesetter. problem with secondary pipe rubbing on front suspension. Posted by Frank Mitchell on October 24, 1999 at 10:42:13: In Reply to: exhaust problem. posted by Brian Gunther on October 23, 1999 at 22:20:24: : Just installed header and exhaust from pacesetter. problem with secondary pipe rubbing on front suspension. I had the same problem with the pipe that was supplied, plus it didn't line up with the converter properly. Posted by Brian G on October 28, 1999 at 00:55:20: Funny thing happend to day when doing a retorque on my whole exhaust system I found a air leak from my new header, how new? It's been in the car for oh about two days, It leaks from the point where the tubes come from the eng. Ya Right there at the seam of the weld. It is a Pace Setter. Posted by Gary Hancock II on October 28, 1999 at 07:30:58: I went through 3 Pacesetter headers before I finally broke down and bought another brand. The pacesetter kept breaking right at the motor like what is happening to you. Save having a headache and buy a different brand header- The extra money is well worth it!! Subject: Re: Newbie Question #3: exhaust system options Date: 1999/11/19 Author: John Connolly Monza's suck. the quiet packs you lose ground clearance. Duals are loud (believe it or not), and you lose power on smaller and mild engines (like yours). I prefer the hideaway systems. John > I am thinking about replacing the stock exhaust. I see in the catalogs and > magazines several reasonable cost options for new exhaust. There is a four tip > exhaust which looks similar to the stock configuration (around $40), a similar > configuration called a "Monza" ($100), Single Quiet Pack exhaust ($40), a > similar configuration but with dual exhaust pipes ($60), a Tuck Away dual > system ($66). > > Does anybody have any experience with these systems or have any endorsements or > warnings concerning them? Would there be any significant performance or > convenience advantage to any of them? > > Thanks for your experience and advice. > > Jim Donaldson > Denver Colorado > 66 Bug 1300 > Subject: Re: Newbie Question #3: exhaust system options Date: 1999/11/21 Author: shane Idleman monza's are a waste of money. Subject: Re: Bus Exhausts Date: 1999/11/21 Author: GazMP The Monza four tip is not a performance exhaust, no matter what the salesman tells you. Any exhaust that flows less than stock is a handicap, not a benefit. Plus they sound crap and don't fit the cut outs on a Beetle as they look like they should. -- Gaz Subject: Tune Up? Date: 01/02/2000 Author: Kurt Abersold I just installed a New Quad tip monza style exhaust system, and Now when I drive, it backfiers and sounds like the timing is off. Also It is harder to start from a stop, and I have to be at a highter speed to change gears without it running wierd. Any ideas? thanks, -Kurt Abersold '73 Super Beetle Subject: Re: Tune Up? Date: 01/02/2000 Author: bugfuel In article <386F146D.D46D2ECB@home.com>, Kurt Abersold wrote: > I just installed a New Quad tip monza style exhaust system, and Now when > I drive, it backfiers and sounds like the timing is off. Also It is > harder to start from a stop, and I have to be at a higher speed to > change gears without it running wierd. Any ideas? > thanks, > -Kurt Abersold > '73 Super Beetle You should have asked or read some older messages. The Monza issue pops up all the time. Your problem is the Monza, they suck. The flow is all wrong. You may get it to work better if you rejet the carb and try to tune the carb and ignition. Personally, I would not recommend the Monza or any of it's copies to anyone, no matter what kind of engine. A design like that just can't work, and it has proven to be just as bad as it seems to be. I have tried just about all most common aftermarket exhausts out there, and the best so far is the one I made myself. Sorry. :-) Oh BTW, on a stock engine, the stock pea-shooter exhaust is THE best choice, also the most quiet one. You can get rid of the "chirping" sound by just replacing the chrome end pipes. Jan Subject: Re: Tune Up? Date: 01/02/2000 Author: Kurt Abersold The leaking would be because I bought a cheap exhaust that didn't fit right, so I had to bend the pipes. It just got it "close enough" Kurt Abersold wrote: > > I just installed a New Quad tip monza style exhaust system, and Now when > I drive, it backfiers and sounds like the timing is off. Also It is > harder to start from a stop, and I have to be at a highter speed to > change gears without it running wierd. Any ideas? > thanks, > -Kurt Abersold > '73 Super Beetle Subject: Re: Performer 4-Tip Exhast Questions??? Date: 01/07/2000 Author: an Andersson GazMP wrote: > > They have mislead you, there is no such thing as a performance 4 tip. There > are performance exhausts and 4 tip exhausts, but the two never meet. Don't > get one, you'll regret it. They make the car look silly and they sound > really rough. I bought a Monza once, I cut the tips off, shortened them, and welded only two of them back on. Looked SO much better, but still didn't work right. I even modified my rear apron cut-outs to match: wider and bigger openings. Looked allright if I may say so. But the exhaust still didn't work any better, the design just plain old sucks. Engine was mild-ish street engine. Jan Subject: Re: Tune Up? Date: 01/02/2000 Author: GazMP I'm afraid you've bought a turkey. Those exhausts flow worse than a stock silencer, although your problem is a leak. Backfiring is nearly always caused by an air leak, at least it is just after an exhaust change anyway. Sort out the leak and go from there. -- Gaz Ramva index http://www.bug-bits.freeserve.co.uk/ramva/index.htm Homepage http://www.bug-bits.freeserve.co.uk/ ** Remove .nospam from address to reply directly from newsgroups ** Kurt Abersold wrote in message news:386F146D.D46D2ECB@home.com... > I just installed a New Quad tip monza style exhaust system, and Now when > I drive, it backfiers and sounds like the timing is off. Also It is > harder to start from a stop, and I have to be at a highter speed to > change gears without it running wierd. Any ideas? > thanks, > -Kurt Abersold > '73 Super Beetle Subject: Re: MONZA(Pacesetter) two tip exaust question Date: 01/27/2000 Author: GazMP "Joey Zaloudek" wrote in message news:38908590@wznews.webzone.net... > I just want something that looks cool, Then forget the Monza. They don't fit the bodywork and will restrict your motor enough that the next week you'll be here asking how to make it get more power like it used to have. Subject: Re: Performer 4-Tip Exhast Questions??? Date: 01/15/2000 Author: GazMP > > That 4-tip one is usually referred to as the "Monza" style exhaust, and > it SUCKS. > > Jan Actually Jan you're wrong there. They more sort of BUNG than SUCK. :-) Gaz Subject: Re: Performer 4-Tip Exhast Questions??? Date: 01/15/2000 Author: Walter Alter I trashed my Monza & put an Empi 4 into 1 and quiet muffler, like I had before. (motor is 1776 w/Engle 110 and dual Weber 40's) when the engine ran great. (I had routed a longer tailpipe u'ed around in front of the muffler and out the center since exhaust fumes were getting sucked into the heater system in my split window bus, but that was heating up the bottom of the motor too much and making it run way hot). I let an old timer Oregon Dunes buggy hotrodder talk me into the Monza. It lasted 3 days & I chucked it. Since the garbage man had come and gone with my old header & muffler, I picked up a set of Empi 4-1 headers and quietmuffler (it _looked_ like the old setup), but the thing still doesn't run right. I noticed that just before the muffler flange, the pipe is necked down to almost the diameter of a single pipe with lots of weld blobs sticking into the exhaust flow. Is this neck causing too much back pressure? I dropped from 20mpg highway to 14 mpg with this exhaust setup and no jet or timing combo seems to touch it (now timed at 28 degrees, but it was at 26 degrees when it was running strong- mechanical distributor, with 130 main jets). It also sounds like shit starting out from a stop, like tapping on a peanut can (no, it aint pinging/pre-detonation) Any help you got would be real welcome. All the local VW speed jockeys got nothing but voodoo for advice ("...you gotta have lots of back pressure", "...a little back pressure is the ticket", ...you got a shock wave that travels the length of the pipe and is reflected back creating a phased vacuum when the exhaust valve opens...", and so on). thanx, Walter -- walter alter artist - heretic - savant www.geocities.com/yollopoliuhqui > That 4-tip one is usually referred to as the "Monza" style exhaust, and > it SUCKS. > It works somehow on stock engines, but it is completely useless and > HURTS performance on anything else. For a stock engine, the stock > exhaust is the Best, most quiet choice. Subject: Re: MONZA(Pacesetter) two tip exaust question Date: 01/27/2000 Author: GazMP "Joey Zaloudek" wrote in message news:38908590@wznews.webzone.net... > I just want something that looks cool, Then forget the Monza. They don't fit the bodywork and will restrict your motor enough that the next week you'll be here asking how to make it get more power like it used to have. -- Gaz Posted by Jonathan Freeman on February 10, 19100 at 02:25:25: In Reply to: Re: You can't posted by Bill Luton on February 09, 19100 at 21:31:58: Michael: If you truly want to make a mistake and waste your (I assume) hard earned money, please buy my old pacesetter header from me. Ever since the last bolt was tightened (had to bend the damn EGR line to fit on it) I've had nothing but problems with that header. 1) Start the car, all the paint burns off in a matter of minutes, causing quite a smoke show. For the next 30 minutes you wait and watch that pretty black burn from the top down to the Cat... lucky I don't live where they salt the roads eh? 2) Drive the car - no "slam you in your seat" performance here, you have to get to 7k on an SOHC to notice power, and then yer rev limiter finds you fast. 3) Listen to the car - even with my Stan's headers Cat-back exhaust, the noise of this header can't be altered to sound anything but annoying. My girlfriend called it the "dead-cat" in my car sound. It's painful. 4) Leaks! - I don't know what block they measured on, but the gaskets they send you with the kit don't FIT the damn block! They send a one-piece exhaust gasket with a c*nt hair sized section between the ports - when that blows, you are truely screwed and performance goes to hell. 5) Fitment! - Try looking cool sitting at a stop light next to a Honda when when your car is going "clank clank clank clank" as the Pacesh*tter starts knocking everything loose on your undercarriage as it rubs. 6) RUST - So your "protective shipping paint" burned off in the first 30 minutes of that headers life - what's next when you drive through a puddle? RUST! I then had a noisy, poorly fitting, aweful sounding, performance robbing, piece of rusty paper thin metal handing one of the more important jobs in my car. All because I was only willing to spend $159 at the time and heard that I needed a header next? I'm sorry, but if you truly need a header, honestly buy mine. I eventually had to put my CRACKED manifold back on the after a few months of that Pacesetter hell. I plan on remedying that situation this weekend when I install Bill's mid-range priced and (I'm assuming here) better fitting header. If you'd like my old pacesetter, it's sitting in the back of my trunk in pieces collecting dust. I'll sell it to you for the low price of 50% of what you'd pay for a new one. Now others have had better luck, maybe they made them differently before, but I learned my lesson once, and don't intend to learn the hard way again. "YOU GET WHAT YOU PAY FOR" Regards, Jonathan (I have pictures too, want 'um?) Subject: Re: Exhaust. Date: 02/10/2000 Author: dragoneyre I recently went from the 4 tipped to the hideout on my Thing. I run a basically stock 1600. When I originally went from the stock muffler to the 4 tipped I didn't notice any difference. The next time I changed (frequently because of the salt on the roads here) I went back to a stock muffler and noticed a big drop in performance. So I went back to a 4 tipped. I've come to dislike the 4 tipped for several reasons. One is that they are not well balanced and I found that I was fouling my #2 and #4 cylinders frequently. I worked with the carb and ignition adjustments for a long time, but never got them to perform as well as I'd like. Still, they're cheap and gave more power than the stock. Another reason I've come to actually despise them, is the scars that they've left on my shins and probably those of unsuspecting patrons in the supermarket parking lots. Most of all, I despise the Pacesetter 4 tipped, because they weld raw steel pipes to a galvanized muffler. Unless you live in the dessert, they last only a few months if that and cost as much as a hideout. Going to the hideout, I found that the manufacture is a little rough, like any budget header, so you have a bit of prying and fussing to do, but it's doable. I like the sound and performance, since I've adjusted my carb to it's liking. It did hit the body and had to be bent down a little (pipe bender here, don't just try to torque it by hand, you could mess it up). There are some snap in dress up items for the old cutouts, or you could weld in fills. The ones I've seen look nice. Best of luck. Dragoneyre Subject: Re: Exhaust. Date: 02/11/2000 Author: P.J. BERG The Monza does not flow better than a NOS mufler, the later so called originals are probably equaly bad as the Monza. J. P.J.Berg Ph.# +47 22594552 Fax. # +47 22569587 Mob. # +47 98681318 Re: Lowering Question/ ?Power Question Date: 02/14/2000 Author: SHO'N'PRV 67 oldspeed vwbug wrote: > I'm debating on the following. > *Muffler/ big bore "MONZA" While your ordering all the rest of the stuff from John at Aircooled.net (heheh), ask him about this exhaust. I say don't get it... Go to the Aircooled.Net Tech Talk article about the engine mods: http://aircooled.net/gnrlsite/resource/articles/mods.htm You'll find quite a bit of info there. -- Nelson Brum Subject: Re: Are Kadrons good carbs ?? Date: 03/13/2000 Author: Searoy I've head bad things about the Monza exhaust. I wouldn't own one. -- *** Teach a Man to Fish *** Searoy Neon IE: Main Board Re: Pacesetter exhaust opininion;s Posted By: Lorenzo Date: Tuesday, 15 February 2000, at 3:21 p.m. In Response To: Pacesetter exhaust opininion;s (kmitchell) Well first off If it is because the price is cheap don't get it! If u live in any area like the mountains and places like that it will rust and rust bad! It's not stainless steel. No clue about the sound. too many people replacing it in a year because that's how bad it rusts. Lorenzo My opinion... Neon IE: Main Board Re: Well, like everything from Pacesetter... Posted By: technoracer Date: Tuesday, 15 February 2000, at 6:29 p.m. In Response To: Re: Well, like everything from Pacesetter... (JT) i had the pacesetter. in my opinion, junk. period. rusted out in a year and a half. Forum: rec.autos.makers.vw.watercooled Subject: Re: Pacesetter 4-into-1 Header: experiences?? Date: 04/17/2000 Author: art clemens Don't do it. Basically junk. Will not last. Get another manifold. If you really want a header there are much better choices. Still the manifold is best bang for the buck Forum: rec.autos.makers.vw.watercooled Subject: Re: Pacesetter 4-into-1 Header: experiences?? Date: 04/17/2000 Author: john_galt Short answer - Get the dual outlet manifold and downpipe. I have no experience with the Pacesetter header, but I have had a dual outlet manifold on a 1983 GTI. Points in favor of the dual outlet manifold and downpipe. Less likely to rust away to nothing. The hottest part (closest to the head) is a heavy casting, where the hottest part of the Pacesetter header is likely to be relatively thin wall exhaust tubing. The heat will stress the metal and make it very prone to rusting out. Smoother power and torque. The dual outlet is basically a Tri-Y design that produces a wider, flatter torque curve. It will be better for around town driving where you are likely to keep the tach between 2,000 and 4,500 RPMs. Quieter. If you want to check out the Pacesetter further, find out what RPM it is tuned for. If they don't know, find out the tubing size and length for the primaries and the diameter and length of the collector. The formulas are available on the Internet or in books. I don't have them handy right now. 4-to-1 headers will boost volumetric efficiency (with a resulting boost in hp and torque) over a very narrow band. Outside that band, they can actually reduce hp and torque. IIRC, the area between 1/4 and 1/2 the tuned RPM's is hit the hardest. Cheaper headers tend to use shorter tubes, which tunes them to higher RPM's. I've seen some cheap headers tuned for 12,000 RPMs or more. Talk about bad, that could reduce power between 3,000 and 6,000 RPMs. Eric Forum: rec.autos.makers.vw.watercooled Subject: Re: Pacesetter 4-into-1 Header: experiences?? Date: 04/19/2000 Author: James Altemus I had the exhaust and it was crap. Food for thought, Jimbo uk.rec.cars.vw.aircooled Subject: Re: Type 1 Exhausts (again) Date: 04/19/2000 Author: GazMP Sounds like he's talking about a Monza. If so, avoid them like the plague Forum: alt.autos.nissan Thread: Exhaust for '96 240SX Subject: Re: Exhaust for '96 240SX Date: 05/25/2000 Author: CWG DONT GO WITH PACESETTER, they dont use the best possible metals and ive heard of them giving out after 6mon of use... spend the money on an exhaust thats going to outlast the car. CaseMan Forum: rec.autos.makers.honda Thread: Pacesetter Bolt-ons Subject: Re: Pacesetter Bolt-ons Date: 04/25/2000 Author: A. Yosafi A while back I got Pacesetter headers for my 95' Civic LX. No matter what I did, it wouldn't stop leaking air. I went back to the stock headers and even though they were a bit worn, they performed better and didn't leak air. A friend of mine just got pacesetter headers and exhaust for his 91' Integra GS and it made the car run even worse, sound like shit and rattles VERY bad. Forum: rec.autos.makers.vw.aircooled Thread: Damn exhaust Subject: Re: Damn exhaust Date: 06/01/2000 Author: Nachi11744 I had never even seen the *monza* until I came to the US, and all the VW shops I have asked about the thing roundly condemn it. Nachi Forum: rec.autos.makers.vw.aircooled Thread: Damn exhaust Subject: Re: Damn exhaust Date: 05/31/2000 Author: Jan Andersson The Monza sucks big time. The flow is totally screwed. It is totally worthless for any mild streeter. Sorry to tell you that. .. even if the FUNCTIONALITY is crap. Trust me with this one. I'm not alone with my opinion, and mine is based on personal experience. I can explain the design flaws of the Monza somehow if you want, but I'm not the best person to do that. jan Forum: rec.autos.makers.honda Thread: Some Questions Regarding 92 Accord EX-R Subject: Re: Some Questions Regarding 92 Accord EX-R Date: 06/27/2000 Author: J. Davis RM wrote: > For under $200, you can get a Pacesetter steel header for the car. > Not the best, but the price is right. Not to be rude, but every Pacesetter header I've ever seen is of sloppy build quality and prone to leaks. Spend the extra bill. Joseph rec.autos.makers.vw.aircooled Thread: new exhaust questions Subject: Re: new exhaust questions Date: 07/03/2000 Author: Shad Laws Don't get the Monza/Pacesetter/whatever. It is a piece of trash. The reasoning is simple: there is NO regard to the lengths of the 4 exhaust paths from each cylinder. Stock exhaust takes note of this, and directs cylinders 2 and 4 at the opposite peashooter in the expansion box to even out the length of cylinders 1 and 3. The extractor deals obviously pay regard to this matter. The Monza doesn't do anything, leaving a poor and uneven running engine... Shad Forum: rec.autos.makers.vw.aircooled Thread: Advice on Sport Style muffler for '74 Bug Subject: Re: Advice on Sport Style muffler for '74 Bug Date: 06/24/2000 Author: Eric Allred If it's a 'Monza' exhaust, you're better off with a stock exhaust. Eric 59 bug Forum: rec.autos.makers.vw.aircooled Thread: Advice on Sport Style muffler for '74 Bug Subject: Re: Advice on Sport Style muffler for '74 Bug Date: 06/25/2000 Author: jeanpaul-99 That exhaust is known as a "Monza". It really is crap - and you'll see them everywhere...best to stay stock (German, but if you want something different, get the one that has a single exit behind the right wheel, and make the fittings TIGHT, or you'll get backfiring, etc.... Reviewed by: Justin Rank - mjmcafee@hotmail.com This product is your typical catback exhaust. The design was pretty basic...nothing fancy. Truth is, that was what I was expecting from a setup that only cost about $150. The only part on the whole setup that looked real nice was the 3 inch tip it came with. The system was made of mild steel which wasn't really a problem since I lived in the Fresno area when I had it installed. I ordered my Pacesetter exhaust from a local speedshop in the area in which I lived. About two weeks or so later I got the call that my exhaust was in. The first problem I encountered was trying to get the crazy thing home in my miata. Once home, I broke out the tool chest and went to work. Only after spending considerable time getting the old exhaust off the cat, did I realize that my exhaust was sent to me void instructions. Not a problem...these things are pretty easy....right? Needless to say, despite my bravest efforts, the thing would NOT fit right under the car. Finally, I gave up and took the whole crazy thing to my local Midas; who, for $50, had to cut and rewend the entire exhaust in order to make the thing fit. Furthermore, the Pacesetter came with only straight hangers that would not support the rubber donuts they were meant to hold. Midas had to weld four new hangers just to get everything from falling off before I got home. To this day, I still have the exhaust on my car, and this whole thing happened three years ago. Once properly adjusted, the setup would have costed me about the same as getting one that fit the first time. One note of interest is that I replaced the 3 inch tip it came with to a 4 inch. I was, on a happier note, satisfied with the nice chrome tip it came with. In conclusion, I would not reccomend the Pacesetter exhaust to anyone out there. It caused me too much pain and made me wish I had gone another route. George ShredSmack@juno.com Pace setter exhaust, yeah one of those cheepo ones. I installed one on my 92 Prelude si, installation was more or less streight foward, but exhaust need some muscle to get in, as the B- pipe seemed a little short, this placing stress on the stock rubber hangers. The exhaust gives a loud raspy sound, This was quieted down using one of those glass pack cherry bomb mufflers, the sound level is now toned down and tame. Also the tips are seem to some times smack against the bumper from time to time. Possibly i got a second grade one? or just getting what i paid for? Few months old and already showing signs or rusting BTW. Forum: rec.autos.makers.honda Thread: does anyone know where i can get headers for a '91 honda civic Subject: Re: does anyone know where i can get headers for a '91 honda civic Date: 07/21/2000 Author: TuRtLeFaRt If your going to get headers for your Civic, go for DC Sports. They make headers to fit most Honda engines and they give noticeable power gains. Don't spend less on a set of headers from Pacesetter or some other crap "Muscle Car" company because they suck, after awhile they will shake loose, or rust; they also don't make alot of power. Go with DC Sports and you will be happy. Tyler turtlefart@aol.com alt.autos.dsm Thread: Any experiences with Pacesetter Catbacks? Subject:Re: Any experiences with Pacesetter Catbacks? Date: 09/05/2000 Author: ArmyGreen Pacesetter exahusts suck. I had one on my '89 Probe GT turbo, and it was a pos (the car and the exahust) First of all, it didn't fit for shit, at certain rpms, it would vibrate badly and bang into my park brake linkage. The instructions were vague at best, the hangers didn't even fit on their pipe, and the seals leaked. Not to mention the yellow tape melted off the tips, and it rusted in a few months. The worst part though, was that I didn't get a power increase, but it actually felt like the car ran worse! It was the same size pipe as the stock, and on a turbo, what's the point of getting a new exahust? I found out the hard way. Do yourself a favor. Get a good system (HKS, Greddy, Thermal Technologies, Extreme Research, etc.) It's worth it. While you're at it, get a new intake as well. (K&N is nice) "Brenn Bacani" wrote in message news:IzGp5.48$%o4.38054@news1.onlynews.com... > I have a '95 Talon TSI AWD, and was searching for a Cat Back system for my > car. I happen to come across a Pacesetter catback for 95+ AWD cars, for > $146! Judging for the description, it's a 2.5 inch system with dual tips, a > complete catback. My question is, has anyone has experience with this > particular system or Pacesetter products in general? The link to the catback > is here: > > http://www.nopionline.com/catalog/equip.asp?ProductID=174070 > > I know you get what you pay for, but this system is 1/3 of other catbacks > I've seen and is insanely cheap. Thanks in advance. > > alt.autos.dsm Thread: Pacesetter icky!!!!!!!!! Subject: Pacesetter icky!!!!!!!!! Date: 08/28/2000 Author: Mortis Ok. it's not on my car, but I put one on my girlfriends 98 Neon, the thing went in ok at best, looks good and has a nice sound. If your not driving it. It drones pretty bad when your in the car. may get on your nerves after the wow cool factor goes away. Then there is the rust problem. The insides of the pipes WERE nice yellow, now it's like $#!t brownish red rust. And the rest of the system is starting to rust badly. Only about 1 and 1/2 years on it. Later, Mortis. alt.autos.dsm Thread: Pacesetter icky!!!!!!!!! Subject: Re: Pacesetter icky!!!!!!!!! Date: 08/28/2000 Author: Brad Mortis wrote: > your nerves after the wow cool factor goes away. Then there is the > rust problem. The insides of the pipes WERE nice yellow, now it's like > $#!t brownish red rust. And the rest of the system is starting to > rust badly. Only about 1 and 1/2 years on it. I always thought painting the insides of exhaust pipes and tips was a bit strange. You'd have to have an extremely clean-running car to be able to see the color after X miles. And I wanted to remind people on the rusting pipe. I see people all the time spending $500 for a catback just to have stainless steel "so it won't rust out in a year." Pipe rusts when it is cheap pipe. Good aluminized pipe can easily last 5-7 years even in the snowbelt. rec.autos.makers.honda Subject: Re: Monza Exhaust Date: 09/29/2000 Author: J. Davis Dean Browne wrote: > My stock exhaust has finally begun to rust through on my 92' Accord EX. > My local Honda dealer is selling complete Monza catback systems on sale > for $110.00! Should I just get stock replacement pipes or "upgrade" to > the Monza?! Thanks! Stock. The Monza will rust thru within two years for little performance gain, as opposed to another 8 years quality service from the stock unit. Joseph rec.autos.makers.vw.aircooled Thread: 72 super beetle exhaust Subject: 72 super beetle exhaust Date: 09/05/2000 Author: bill want to jazz up my exhaust system on my 72 super beetle been told monza type exhaust is crap.want good sound are tuned exhaust way to go?.don't want stock old man car going for low/wide/and cooooool thanks bill e mail wilste00@email.com Posted By: Jason V (152.163.213.67) Posted On: 10/23/2000 @ 4:08 PM Subject: In desperate need of a stock catalytic converter I recently bought another geo storm a GSI this time and decided to by a pacesetter exhaust and header (it's only my work car). Any way as I was installing the header which bolted up nicely (but was mis-aligned on the bottom side) my friend took it upon himself to knock out my catalytic. I had to spend 160.00 for the muffler shop to straighten and adjust the piping in order to make it work and I really can't afford to spend another $130 plus for another one. Thanks Jason V xjv29x@aol.com Posted By: Jason V (152.163.213.67) Posted On: 10/23/2000 @ 4:18 PM Subject: Pacesetter cat-back I purchased my pacesetter exhaust. I only had problems with the header installation. Jason V xjv29x@aol.com Posted By: jawb (152.163.207.54) Posted On: 10/23/2000 @ 5:03 PM Subject: Pacesetter...lol What kind of HP diff. did it do for you? I got that for me storm and didnt feel a thing. You should see how much it would cost to get a custom one made. Thats what I did and it feels like night and day. rec.autos.makers.vw.aircooled Thread: Monza exhaust question Subject: Re: Monza exhaust question Date: 10/18/2000 Author: Brad Irwin dont bother with monza exhaust they are restrictive and will make your engine run rich. B IRWIN Radovan Fijember wrote in message news:8sg0nk$8qdd$1@as121.tel.hr... > Is there Monza exhaust system with single tips for VW 1302 ('72)? If yes, > where can I buy it? > alt.autos.toyota.trucks Thread: 91' 2wd 22-re: Pacesetter Headers Subject: Re: 91' 2wd 22-re: Pacesetter Headers Date: 11/18/2000 Author: GJS PaceSetter seems to be at the low end of the aftermarket headers -- they seem to warp at the mounting flange and rust out quickly. alt.autos.corvette Thread: Pacesetter Monza Mufflers Subject: Pacesetter Monza Mufflers Date: 11/15/2000 Author: Ray I Just got a set of these mufflers for my 86 and I would advise that others avoid same because: Rear hanger has a much smaller bolt that the original Corvette uses Inlets are much larger than the guts of the muffler and are cobbled up and welded on to the smaller inlet pipes inside of the muffler. Outlets are the same situation - Small pipe inside muffler (looks to be about 2") is welded to reduced down outlet pipe from the tips which are at least 2 1/2" Mufflers are painted instead of original looking Sound is mediocre at best Sorry I bought them Ray alt.autos.corvette Thread: Borla Exhaust Subject: Re: Borla Exhaust Date: 12/09/2000 Author: Ray Some of the aftermarket mufflers like a Pacesetter Monza have very cheap mufflers that are made in Mexico. The mufflers have very small internal pipes in the muffler and large outlet pipes cobbled to then and welded on in a very sloppy manner. I have these mufflers on my car - don not buy them! Ray Forum: alt.autos.toyota.trucks Thread: 91' 2wd 22-re: Pacesetter Headers Subject: Re: 91' 2wd 22-re: Pacesetter Headers Date: 11/18/2000 Author: GJS PaceSetter seems to be at the low end of the aftermarket headers -- they seem to warp at the mounting flange and rust out quickly. Forum: rec.autos.makers.vw.aircooled Thread: type 2 exhust Subject: Re: type 2 exhust Date: 01/04/2001 Author: Jan Andersson The Monza type exhausts are probably the WORST design out there. They work acceptably on a stock engine, but the flow and backpressure are all wrong for any street engine, mild or wild. It's way worse than a stock exhaust system even when installed on a stock engine. If you look at the muffler, one of the first things you see that the exhaust pipes are not equal lenght, and they enter the muffler from the ends.. facing each other inside. Making one pipe shoot the exhaust gases into the opposite side pipe.. (of course the internal parts of the muffler prevent that for the most part, but you get the idea.) Then, the exhaust gases must make one or more 90 degree turns to finally exit the muffler. It's been discussed here before.. the Monza style system just plain old sucks. I had one (of course) at one point in my stupid youth, and I ended up cutting the two extra outlets off, and relocating the remaining two outlets.. they exited more or less from the original rear apron openings. Still didn't work worth a damn though. Flat spots and overheating.. and generally poor driveability.. Which all went away once I installed a single quiet pack. (Not the greatest muffler either.. today I make my own systems from higher quality parts..) Jan Posted By: gamezone (4.54.70.158) Posted On: 01/07/2001 @ 7:18 PM Subject: I don't know ... if I should be happy P#@&*&tte*r makes a cat back for the Storm or sad because it's one of the poorest quality add ons I've ever purchased. I was so happy when I paid $160.00 for a whole cat back! So pi%^ed off when I tried to use it. Buy the best and forget it. Mike Subject: Re: Kadron Quite Duel Silencer vs' EMPI Monza 4 tip From: Jan Andersson Date: 2001/02/01 Message-ID: <3A790FAE.5BF421C9@rocketmail.com> Newsgroups: rec.autos.makers.vw.aircooled Regarding the Monza unit.. forget them, they are all crap. The whole design is stupid. Subject: Re: Kadron Quite Duel Silencer vs' EMPI Monza 4 tip From: dragoneyre@my-deja.com Date: 2001/02/02 Message-ID: <95dkm9$99v$1@nnrp1.deja.com> Newsgroups: rec.autos.makers.vw.aircooled Jan's got it right. There is a lot of adjustment to tweak in anything but the stock unit on a stock motor. Like I said, I tried the four tipped, and It worked ok. If you do try one, just don't get the Pacesetter! It's a galvanized muffler but the pipes are raw steel so it rusts out fast Subject: Re: Kadron Quite Duel Silencer vs' EMPI Monza 4 tip From: School of Journalism Date: 2001/02/01 Message-ID: <3A79E29D.6D438781@jcomm.uoregon.edu> Newsgroups: rec.autos.makers.vw.aircooled avoid monza mufflers Ryan Subject: Re: Kadron Quite Duel Silencer vs' EMPI Monza 4 tip From: "Cale Fraser" Date: 2001/01/31 Message-ID: Newsgroups: rec.autos.makers.vw.aircooled [More Headers] I have never met a person who has been happy with the monza..it looks to me..like you would have very bad "flow" with that exhaust system..it just does not look smooth..and the tubes are diffrent lenghts.. the Kadron..I dunno either..but if its anything like a single quiet pack..it will walk all over the monza..smoother flowing..and dual quiet pack would have even less restriction... but might loose tiny ammount of low end.. Cale Peter Mac wrote in message news:95a402$gji$1@neptunium.btinternet.com...
Mohammad's Hot Shot Header Review I bought my car used about five years ago. Since then I have been changing things to make my car faster. I know that it is not an M3 but It is my baby and every little bit helps. I have always wanted a header for my car. I know about Hot Shot header Co. for a while now. I was under the misconception that they knew how to make a good fitted header. Today I found out that they do not make a quality header. It took me 3 hours to install my header and it did not fit perfectly. I got there header for my 90 240 and it took me 3 hours to but the dam thing on. The EGR valve was not placed right on the header so I had to bend it so it will be able to fit. The bottom end of the header is hitting my cars floor board. They did not include any gaskets. I am just very disappointed in HOTSHOT PERFORMANCE. Yes, the second piece (lower part of the header) is hitting my floor board. The dam thing keeps vibrating. Sincerely, Mohammed wantmorepower@hotmail.com Ken's Hotshot Header Review Name: ken Email: Product: hot shot header Model: Store: option auto saloon Price: $280 Car: 240sx/s-13/91 Worth_it: No Difficulty_Rating: 5 Date: 21 Dec 1998 Problems header and cat. did not line up included no gaskets. Tips twist secondary pipe and have it welded together so it lines up correctly Other don't buy this. Subject: Blown Headers Date: 1999/07/25 Author: Al ClapsaddleA couple of days ago while cruising on the E-Way, I heard a large "boom". It sounded like a huge truck backfire and that is what I thought it was at first (I was passing a 18 wheeler). Well, when I slowed down because of rush-hour traffic, my car just "seemed" different. As soon as I could, I pulled off the E-Way and stopped on a side-street. I looked the car over and everything looked OK. I continued toward home but the car was still not quite right. When I got home, I checked again under the hood with my trouble-light. The pipes that form the "Y" from 1 and 4 (off the engine block) had a crack at the weld! I put the car up on some ramps and checked underneath and could not find any other hole or crack. I had heard from others who had modified their Saturns, that some of the Hotshot Headers were cracking. It could not have come at a worse time (because of the Car Show at Homecoming). Subject: Re: HOTSHOT INTAKE? Date: 1999/08/02 Author: Mike6879 dont get the hotshot intake i lost 20 hp from my drop in kn dont do it Posted by Joseph Philbert on November 12, 1999 at 08:21:10: Hi Just Took My Headers Out the Box HOT-SHOT Guess What they made the Attachment for the EGR Vavle BUT there is NO hole!!! Subject: Cracked Headers Date: 1999/11/24 Author: Kelley Poag It looks to me as if I may soon have the misfortune of having my $300 HotShot headers crack on me. I looked under the hood a day or two ago and I noticed a dark line outlining the weld joint on my header. Bummer for me. It won't be long before it opens wide up and starts making a hell of a racket. I thought I heard that HotShot was offering special prices (should be free IMO) on their headers for those that bought theirs recently and have had them crack. Did I read correctly? Has anyone taken HotShot up on the new header offer? Curious. Kelley Subject: Re: Cracked Headers Date: 1999/11/24 Author: aclapsaddle Kelley, I had to replace my Headers right before Homecoming. Hotshot does have a special price for replacing. If under 1 year then they are FREE. If over 1 year (if I remember correctly) 1/2 price. I am glad you posted. I returned my OLD Headers and they were suppose to credit my Master Card and I don't think they have done it yet! Al Subject: Re: upgrades Date: 01/24/2000 Author: Lane Hotshot has said that before. I know someone whose 'new design' header installed within the last 6 months has already cracked badly. Expect the worst. Lane [ l a n e @ a u d i o p h i l e . c o m ] --- Visit my Saturn Car Audio & Performance Page at http://www57.pair.com/lane "Brad Logan" wrote in message news:86h086$ali@nnrp4.farm.idt.net... > Talked to SPS the other day, the header should be available soon for the > 99+, it has been prototyped and tested and they are now starting to produce > them for filling orders, Hotshot said that they fixed the design flaw from > their previous headers which had a tendency to crack at the welds > "Noah Bolmer" wrote in message > news:388A0B2F.8BB9FCD6@mailandnews.com... > > I have a '99 SC2 and I'm about to start mod'ing it. I have a '67 mustang > > back in Los Angeles that I've been working on since I was a kid, but now > > I'm in Lawschool in Cleveland- the salt would kill the stang, so I > > treated myself last year to a new saturn. So, I'm going to start with > > the interior- I have gray leather- does anyone know if the carbon fibre > > kit looks cool? White gauge faces? I'd really appreciate some ideas to > > get this project started, as well as sources for the best prices. Next, > > I'll hit the engine/intake - probably the ceramic powerstack/K&N/ and > > t-body. Maybe a header- tho I've heard lots of problems- does anyone > > make a really good reliable header? One last question- back home, at the > > dealership, there was a Saturn on the lot that was mod'ed with some > > really cool wheels. They had 5 arms I think and what looked like a red > > anodized nut in the middle. 15 inch I think. Thanks all :) > > > > Noah Bolmer > > '99 SC2 - loaded > > pacman@mailandnews.com Forum: rec.autos.makers.saturn Subject: Re: Air Filter question Date: 03/14/2000 Author: Saturn Services bandit is correct, losing the stock airbox and installing the K+N cone will give you all the h.p. and efficiency of the hotshot, the tube is for looks. ive dynoed 3 Saturn's with the tube verses the stock tube with k+N there was NO difference in h.p. all 3 cars were within 2-3 h.p. gain with both stock tube and custom tubes. the drop in k+n is not as effective as using the 9x3 cone and eliminating the airbox. I talked bandit through his install, anyone can do it, what did it take bandit? 3 e-mails and you were done, right? later guys! Forum: rec.autos.makers.saturn Subject: Re: Air Filter question Date: 03/16/2000 Author: Frank Yang Just curious. The stock unit sucks in air from the side of the engine compartment where the air is cool, while the K&N cone sucks in hot air near the engine. Wouldn't the hot air reduce the minimal gain achieved by having a cone? The problem is that you won't see the hot air effect on a dyno, since the hood is usually propped open during dyno test so that the cone can suck in cold air. On the race track or street, it may be a different story. Saturn S-series does not have a front grill to allow cold air in. Just a thought, any comments welcome. - Frank ('95 SL1 & '00 Accord S.E.) Forum: rec.autos.makers.saturn Thread: Ordering from SPS??? Read this first... Subject: Re: Ordering from SPS??? Read this first... Date: 06/06/2000 Author: Kelley Poag As far as complaining about SPS goes I think the HotShot header issue is far more worthy of outcry than the powerstack ever will be. Spend $350 on a set of headers and have the welds crack on you within 12 months THEN you got yourself something to complain about. For crying out loud I have to BUY the replacement for the defective part! Either that or take it to a muffler shop to see if the weld can be reinforced. Either way it's going to cost ME!
rec.autos.makers.honda Thread: AEM cold air intake during rain?? Subject: Re: AEM cold air intake during rain?? Date: 12/28/1999 Author: Lee CGeorge Knighton wrote: > > In article , "Mista Bone" > writes: > > >Make sure you follow the instructions to the letter. > > Although I agree with you, I couldn't help laughing when I saw this. > > AEM's instructions are awful. :) Hee hee... yea... but you should see Weapon R's instructions. It pretty much reads: 1. Open hood. 2. Remove stock air filter system. 3. Install new air filter system. At least AEM *attempts* to tell you how to do it. I just installed an AEM cold air intake on my '98 Accord. I took some pictures along the way... I'll be posting instructions on my web site so that future AEM cold air purchasers won't spent the 5 hours that I did installing their new filter. The instructions were wordy... but pretty ambiguous. For example, I had no idea which end the second intake pipe should be connected to the first intake pipe (the '98 V6 accord's AEM intake pipe comes in two pieces). I also had to use a piece of foam to pad under the tube or else it would have gotten scratched and dented as it rubbed against the chassis. Sigh... oh well, having installed (but soon removed) a Weapon R intake on my mom's Toyota Corolla, and now an AEM, the AEM kit is a HUGE value compared to the Weapon R kit. The Weapon R kit comes with a generic chromed steel intake tube, with a cheap looking foam filter element. It also comes with a couple feet of purple vacuum hose, which neither fits the vehicle hose, nor does it fit the metal fitting on the Weapon R intake. Made me wonder what they were used for. The Weapon R was also loud, regardless of throttle position. It buzzed, groaned... The AEM kit comes with two aluminum tubes that are *obviously* of high quality, a K&N type filter element pre-treated with that red oil stuff. It comes with a chassis rubber mount, three rubber coupling bands, and all the necessary metal clamps to do the installation. The AEM's $225 asking price is a *BARGAIN* compared to the $160 they want for the Weapon R. Though it took me a while, after it was installed, everything fit without modification... > > -------------------- > > '00 Black ITR #110 (USDM) -- Lee Cao - www.leecao.com rec.autos.makers.honda Thread: Best Intake - what's your opinion? Subject: Best Intake - what's your opinion? Date: 12/01/1999 Author: tlow If you are the owner of any of the listed below intakes, we're looking for your opinion. AEM - Cold Air System | Short Ram System Iceman - Cool Air System | Air Force Ram Air Scoop DC Sports - Direct Air Charger | Max Air K&N - Air Filters Kits | Drop-In Greddy/Trust - AirInx RS Akimoto- Funnel Ram II HKS - Super Powerflow Weapon*R - V2 Intake System http://speedsource.iscci.com/aem.htm SpeedSource is hosting an informal shootout of the intakes. Our last survey resulted with AEM taking the top spot with 46% of the voters picks. Of course, polls can only provide a narrow view as to why that particular make was chosen, which is why SpeedSource is gathering your opinion. We've been shopping for intakes and have found so many set-ups it's mind boggling. We've discovered sponges, cotton, paper or worse nothing at all. Please readers, don't ever run with a filter - it's a quick way to destroy your engine! We'd like you to share your experience. Your View is SpeedSource's review and rating system by which you, our readers, review and rate the products that make up our sport. Your experience with a product will help others make more informed purchasing decisions. It is your chance to help share what you know with the online community. If you have dyno results that show how much horspower you gained or lost from your intake submit it to SpeedSource@iscci.com Results from our last poll: AEM 46% DC Sports 5% Iceman 20% K & N (drop-in) 7% OBX 5% RS Akimoto 10% Stock 0% Weapon R 7% http://speedsource.iscci.com/aem.htm Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy. alt.autos.toyota Thread: Weapon-R??? Subject: Re: Weapon-R??? Date: 02/25/1999 Author: Corolla Man <99corolla@toyota.com> I had a weapon r intake on my 96 tercel, it didnt do a damn thing!!! Just made more noise!!! Aftermarket intakes usually add poor performance to a car instead of helping it. corolla man Jerry Howell wrote in message <7b1lv5$1mr$1@winter.news.rcn.net>... >I put a weapon-r intake on my girlfriend's 97 tercel. Installation wasn't >too bad, although I had to buy a crankcase breather. It seemed to help >performance a little, but that may be an illusion due to the increased sound >it makes. Stay away from the pacesetter exhausts, They use cheap metal and >seem to rust out very quickly. Spend the extra money and get a stainless if >you plan on keeping the car more than a year. >Swoosh1859 wrote in message ><19990224002834.01138.00002261@ng-cd1.aol.com>... >>I ordered a Weapon R intake system for my Corolla GT-S. Anyone have any >>opinions on weapon R parts and/or stories of success or failure theyve had with >>these products? Would also like an opinion on Pacesetter exhausts. They make >>one for my car, and it isnt too expensive, i just dont want something too loud. >>thanks. > > rec.autos.makers.honda Thread: Weapon R Intake Subject: Re: Weapon R Intake Date: 12/03/1998 Author: tfox [ you know what to do with this ] They are lying. The quality of their pipes is terrrible. Specifically: Their pipes often look as if they got a order for something and then went to their scrap pile and looked for something that would fit and cut the excess off. The anodizing is of marginal quality as well. I went through two different pipes, both had black marks on the outside and were rough inside. I don't see how a pipe that is rough inside can possible be the best. Roughness only reduces air velocity. Another thing. The shitty pipes hang from the rubber boot that attaches to the throttle body. Luckily I noticed before any serious damage was caused, but the pipe wore through the rubber coating around an AC line. Let's not forget that it took 3 weeks to get the weapon r pipe in the first place. Every week it was going to be a few more days. I guess someone accidentally threw their inventory away thinking it was scrap. I have since switched to an AEM and couldnt be happier. On 3 Dec 1998 00:48:53 GMT, randym4177@aol.com (RandyM4177) wrote: >Weapon R intake claims to be the best, does anyone have any proof to support >this claim or are they lying? rec.autos.makers.honda Thread: Intake questions....... Subject: Re: Intake questions....... Date: 02/22/1999 Author: Mista Bone armen, the reason the AEM increases hp is NOT due to the cooler air. It is due to the resonant tuning of the intake system. Granted the cooler air helps, maybe an extra 1-2 hp. The Weapon R etc. intakes are tuned for 8500+ rpm level. The AEM makes it power between 3600 and 5200 rpm, where a Honda can use it. C. Tague aka. Mista Bone "Baby won't you rock it tonight." 93 Honda Civic DX HB 1.5L NO VTEC! #17 DSP AEM,Neuspeed, Eibach, Stillen, & BFG R1 15.56 @ 84 mph 1/4mile 2.02 60 ft. rec.autos.makers.honda Thread: Weapon R Subject: Re: Weapon R Date: 04/13/1999 Author: [please remove this to reply]com (T. Fox) On Tue, 13 Apr 1999 12:19:39 -0400, jonk@uscom.com wrote: >Does Weapon R have a web site that anyone knows of? >jonk www.weapon-r.com I would steer clear of their products though. I bought an intake pipe from them for my integra. Biggest piece of shit I ever bought for a car. The pipe looked like they had gotten the order and wandered out back to their dumpster and rotted around until they found a piece that was close enough to fit my applicate. It was clear that the pipe the sent me had been bent from something else's scrap. the ends were angled all wrong, It never fit quite right (although it did fit, so it wasnt REALLY the wrong one) there are no supports so the whole thing just sort of hung off the throttle body. the anodizing was the worst I've ever seen. I do like their filters though. Based on that experience I'll not be buying any of their products again. rec.autos.makers.honda Thread: Intake questions....... Subject: Re: Intake questions....... Date: 02/22/1999 Author: Armen Kaleshian Cal Kid wrote: > I have a 93 accord and am wondering should I get a cone intake? I was > talking to many people and they say they got it becuase it looks cool. > Do you loose hp with a non aem/iceman intake. I want to know because I > wanna get a weapon r but the more I see it The more I think about it. I > might lose hp and I have nothing to lose with 140 hp. Let me know about > your thoughts > ck Cal, Usually, the aftermarket intakes like the Weapon and the other one's that grab the air from your engine compartment do increase HP but not as much as the AEM/IceMan intakes do because those intakes reach down around your bumper area where they can get colder air. The only thing you have to watch out for is when it rains, the water can get into the intake and really screw things up, that's why you get the street and strip versions of the IceMan or the AEM and life will be good. =) You can throw the street on when it's wet outside, and the strip one on when it's nice and dry outside. =) Good Luck, ~armen 91 Honda Accord rec.autos.makers.honda Thread: How to install aftermarket intake? Subject: Re: How to install aftermarket intake? Date: 02/19/1999 Author: Lee Cao STEPHEN CHUCH MAU wrote: > > I'm a beginner at installing things in my engine. So bear with me. I want > to install a Weapon-R intake system into my 96' Civic 4dr Lx. I thought it > might be simple, but I can't figure how to take out the OEM intake. Can > someone please tell me how to do this. You shouldn't have bought a Weapon R intake. See if you can return it and get something else instead. Try something from DC Sports, RS Akimoto. Or even AEM, if you can swing $220. Weapon-R intakes are cheap, and don't come with any instrucitons. I made the mistake of getting one, but returned it. A waste of my time. Their intakes are not custom made at all... Very generic looking. > Stephen -- Lee Cao - http://www.leecao.com/ If I had 100 million dollars... Submitted by Bosco from Canada Date Reviewed: 10/12/00 9:16:21 PM Used product for 6 months to 1 year Weaknesses: loss of low end torque Review Summary: I noticed a little loss at low end. Submitted by Kyle from Lawrenceville, GA Date Reviewed: 10/10/00 11:06:45 AM Used product for 1 to 6 months Model info: accord Weaknesses: filter gets dirty fast, not enough clearance for hood, it hits it barely Review Summary: I think its a little dumb about the filter which is why im probably going to go with a DC sports DAC when i get my new Mirage. Submitted by Ricard from Billings, Montana,US Date Reviewed: 8/21/00 2:28:21 PM Used product for Less than 1 month Model info: '87 Accord LX-i Weaknesses: Not enough clearence when the hood is closed, the filter touches the top of the hood slightly, but its not seriuos. Submitted by Mtbeaver from Charlotte Date Reviewed: 8/2/00 8:16:42 AM Used product for 1 to 6 months Model info: 1997 Prelude SH Weaknesses: NO install instructions, I had to go out to the web. Review Summary: Off the line I see little to no difference. Submitted by James Rakestraw from Orange, FL, USA Date Reviewed: 7/31/00 3:41:31 PM Used product for 1 to 6 months Model info: 1999 Honda Civic Si Weaknesses: Low end suffers, so pulling off the stop light requires a little more gas. The plastic filter looks like it came from a toy. Review Summary: $120 for the kit. I would look into other kits before considering this one. There are several other intakes at similar prices that offer better filter quality. Submitted by Gil from Louisville, Ky Date Reviewed: 7/29/00 12:36:52 PM Used product for 1 to 6 months Model info: 91' Accord EX Weaknesses: The colored filters dont stay colored too long. Yellow will become dark yellow, blue will become dark blue and so on. You should be fine with the black. Review Summary: I paid $140 for my Weapon R which is pretty average. The performance varies from car to car depending on the engine. The Weapon R intakes are good, but for the $80 I paid for the entire ractive system, I believe that is a much better choice...and they look good too. Submitted by Justin Garre from Sumner, WA USA Date Reviewed: 1/5/00 5:07:02 PM Used product for 1 to 6 months Model info: '97 Honda Civic EX Weaknesses: The filter! The Weapon R's filter can not be taken apart to clean. You have to either buy a whole new filter ($40) each time it needs replacing, or buy a different brand's filter (Most filters are universal). Also, the sound can be a little much when on full acceleration. Review Summary: I paid about $140 for my intake. I would reccomend not buying the Weapon R because of the filter problem. Instead, go for Akimoto. Their filters are K&N and easily cleaned so you wont have to buy a new filter every time your current one becomes dirty.
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